Custom fonts

[qcdadmin]

I am disabling the custom fonts and sizes. They are 'unclean' and make the forum unreadble. Disabling these features will make the forum much easier on the eyes.

Since those tags are now disabled you might want to clean up your signatures and posts that contain those vb codes.

[Todd The Kiwi]

i believe this is toes fault for posting that stupid 13 year old girl aol post!!!!!!
I HOPE YOU'RE HAPPY TOE!!!!!

[Matt]

it was no ones fault. The custom font's are hard to read period. Distract from the content of the post.

[Todd The Kiwi]

it was no ones fault. The custom font's are hard to read period. Distract from the content of the post.

until toe complained there was no issue as far as i was aware,
he has screwed it up for all of us man

[Matt]

until toe complained there was no issue as far as i was aware,
he has screwed it up for all of us man
I'm not going to budge on the font sizes and types. I'll give you freedom to use coloured text.

I ask that you use it within reason as well, otherwise it will go. That also goes for the bold text. A lot of the time people use bold text as emphasis, so some of your posts appear as if your shouting.

I want you to be creative, but please, just do it within reason.

[Todd The Kiwi]

I'm not going to budge on the font sizes and types. I'll give you freedom to use coloured text.

I ask that you use it within reason as well, otherwise it will go. That also goes for the bold text. A lot of the time people use bold text as emphasis, so some of your posts appear as if your shouting.

I want you to be creative, but please, just do it within reason.
i assure you i wasn't shouting man

[plover]

Without any control over fonts, there is one usability issue that comes up for developers. I have always tried to put small bits of code into a fixed width font as I feel this improves readability (defence exhibit A: it is the standard format used in computer books). The "code" tag is fine for chunks of code, but, given that it imposes a box broken out from the main text, it is not effective for variable names and other small things that work best embedded within a sentence.

Perhaps it would possible to enable Courier and maybe a few other standard fonts without disrupting the forum too much. Or maybe there could be a "fixed" tag like in the old forum.

(Actually, the vB code docs don't say anything about a box around the contents of the "code" tag, maybe you could just get rid of the boxes... Unlike the point above though, this is a private gripe, I don't like the boxes around any of the forum post elements -- I think they break up the flow of the posts. IMHO, indentation and line spacing mark off quotes and suchlike enough. Thinking about it a bit, it seems that it's not so much the box itself that bugs me as the visual interaction between the box border and the resulting chunk of white space framing the box. I also dislike the box labels. It seems to me that the system should never impose text on the interior of a post.

Why this should be an occasion for all my petty grouses about forum formatting I'm not sure though... :) )

[Todd The Kiwi]

hi plover , man you have lost your trademark font mate , go and vote , go ...

[Tokelil]

i believe this is toes fault for posting that stupid 13 year old girl aol post!!!!!!
I HOPE YOU'RE HAPPY TOE!!!!!
As far as I remember his post was a sarcastic post triggered by other post containing formatting besides the useful formatting.

[rorythedog]

Without any control over fonts, there is one usability issue that comes up for developers. I have always tried to put small bits of code into a fixed width font as I feel this improves readability (defence exhibit A: it is the standard format used in computer books). The "code" tag is fine for chunks of code, but, given that it imposes a box broken out from the main text, it is not effective for variable names and other small things that work best embedded within a sentence.

Perhaps it would possible to enable Courier and maybe a few other standard fonts without disrupting the forum too much. Or maybe there could be a "fixed" tag like in the old forum.

(Actually, the vB code docs don't say anything about a box around the contents of the "code" tag, maybe you could just get rid of the boxes... Unlike the point above though, this is a private gripe, I don't like the boxes around any of the forum post elements -- I think they break up the flow of the posts. IMHO, indentation and line spacing mark off quotes and suchlike enough. Thinking about it a bit, it seems that it's not so much the box itself that bugs me as the visual interaction between the box border and the resulting chunk of white space framing the box. I also dislike the box labels. It seems to me that the system should never impose text on the interior of a post.

Why this should be an occasion for all my petty grouses about forum formatting I'm not sure though... :) )


hi Plover. It's not often that I get lost but, after reading the above, I,m flummoxed. Right over my head :ponder:

[Todd The Kiwi]

As far as I remember his post was a sarcastic post triggered by other post containing formatting besides the useful formatting.

"useful" ? i can't see how a font can be useful or useless man .

[Heigar]

I could see limiting font sizes,If posts by some people bother you just add them to your ignore list and won't have to read it.It doesn't bother me that people want to be creative what bothers me is the people that bitch about it!

[Todd The Kiwi]

I could see limiting font sizes,If posts by some people bother you just add them to your ignore list and won't have to read it.It doesn't bother me that people want to be creative what bothers me is the people that bitch about it!
amen mate,amen. if you don't like fonts and sigs disable them or put people with creativity on your ignore list ...

[Tokelil]

Yer okay. But disabling all post from some members is the last resort for me! Id rather bitch a month before doing that! I like to read what people thing!
I just don't want it to flash in my face when there is absolutely no reason to do so. The posts looses readability when using 4096 different colors in a post.

[rorythedog]

Everybody......................................... ..................CHILL!

Or there'll be no :beer: for any of you :devil:

[Tokelil]

Everybody......................................... ..................CHILL!

Or there'll be no :beer: for any of you :devil:Hey. It's weekend! I'll promise you there's :beer: !! Or else...

[Todd The Kiwi]

Yer okay. But disabling all post from some members is the last resort for me! Id rather bitch a month before doing that! I like to read what people thing!
I just don't want it to flash in my face when there is absolutely no reason to do so. The posts looses readability when using 4096 different colors in a post.

i don't know where you get your statistics man, but i don't use this many colours, rarely more than 2 (black is not a colour)

[Heigar]

One thing I don't understand that there are other members on the forum who do the same thing (color text and different sizes)and for the longest time (I won't mention any names),some of those posts different colors and text you need a magnifying glass to read,no body bitched then why?but as soon as Todd the Kiwi starts to do it shit hits the fan.I show all members here respect no matter how expressful they are in which i think some of you have lost!!

[Todd The Kiwi]

One thing I don't understand that there are other members on the forum who do the same thing (color text and different sizes)and for the longest time (I won't mention any names),some of those posts different colors and text you need a magnifying glass to read,no body bitched then why?but as soon as Todd the Kiwi starts to do it shit hits the fan.I show all members here respect no matter how expressful they are in which i think some of you have lost!! if everybody took a leaf out of heigars book we would all get along fine ,with or without creativity ...

[Matt]

One thing I don't understand that there are other members on the forum who do the same thing (color text and different sizes)and for the longest time (I won't mention any names),some of those posts different colors and text you need a magnifying glass to read,no body bitched then why?but as soon as Todd the Kiwi starts to do it shit hits the fan.I show all members here respect no matter how expressful they are in which i think some of you have lost!!In no way I am trying to be disrespectful to Todd. I encourage creative conversations and creativity in general.

What I am doing is enforcing some rules to create the best atmosphere for all users of this forum. I am asking todd and all other users to adhere to these posting rules. I am of the opinion that large obscure font types with rainbow colours distracting to the post's content (which should ideally contain the members verbal creativity vs. their visual).

We don't enforce much here in these forums, and we let most threads go untouched (which I enjoy). So, all I ask is that you adhere to these new posting rules for the overall benefit of the community.

If you would like, I can create a forum in the community section dedicated to member's artwork. Then you can truly express your visual creativity and receive feedback as well.

[Todd The Kiwi]

jeez man it wasn't me who posted that post with all the pretty rainbow colours it was "toe" i appreciate that you are not disrespecting me but ...
and what's the story with him posting my pm too ? that was totally wrong man .

[Heigar]

In no way I am trying to be disrespectful to Todd. I encourage creative conversations and creativity in general.

What I am doing is enforcing some rules to create the best atmosphere for all users of this forum. I am asking todd and all other users to adhere to these posting rules. I am of the opinion that large obscure font types with rainbow colours distracting to the post's content (which should ideally contain the members verbal creativity vs. their visual).

We don't enforce much here in these forums, and we let most threads go untouched (which I enjoy). So, all I ask is that you adhere to these new posting rules for the overall benefit of the community.

If you would like, I can create a forum in the community section dedicated to member's artwork. Then you can truly express your visual creativity and receive feedback as well.Point taken,and the idea for the creativity section would be a good idea ,there are some of us who really enjoy creative posting and looking at creative posting you're doing a good job with the forum(if it was any other forum a lot of us would have been banned already)and one other thing when am I going to beable to change my username back,it is driving me nuts when trying to log in,cuz I forget that I changed it?And I agree with todd that posting a pm is disrespectful.

[Inthewoods]

well, I can't get ANYTHING to work now as far as my profile so I'll go without any ID.....no avatar, no signature.....nothin'..............this really bites

[Matt]

well, I can't get ANYTHING to work now as far as my profile so I'll go without any ID.....no avatar, no signature.....nothin'..............this really bites
nothing works in the User CP? Please elaborate.

Does anyone else have this issue?

[Todd The Kiwi]

well, I can't get ANYTHING to work now as far as my profile so I'll go without any ID.....no avatar, no signature.....nothin'..............this really bites
dude man i hear your plight that kind of sucks have this one man ...

[Matt]

And I agree with todd that posting a pm is disrespectful.
if you are offended by any posts... there is a little '!' button that will allow you to report a bad post. Like I said, I will let people express themselves freely, but if it gets out of hand i will close the thread.

[Todd The Kiwi]

nothing works in the User CP? Please elaborate.

Does anyone else have this issue?
:skull: i just changed my location so it works for me ... :skull:

[Todd The Kiwi]

if you are offended by any posts... there is a little '!' button that will allow you to report a bad post. Like I said, I will let people express themselves freely, but if it gets out of hand i will close the thread.

i did that and i saw no change man ,
he got away "scot free" we are all being reprimanded for his actions .
i didn't even get a reply from you guys ... why not ?

[Inthewoods]

Well, I just can't get anything to format. For instance, I set my signature (WOODS) to be bold and in blue... the preview black regular text, and what it produces in a post is what you see below...nothin' blank nada zilch...it's no biggie really Matt, I just think it's a shame it had to be changed.

[Matt]

i did that and i saw no change man , he has got away "scot free" we are all being reprimanded for his actions .
i didn't even get a reply from you guys ... why not ?what post are you referring too. I have no idea who Toe is. (believe it or not, i don't read all the posts)

EDIT: ok, i think i found the one you are referring too. is it 'bitching anyone?'

[Todd The Kiwi]

what post are you referring too. I have no idea who Toe is. (believe it or not, i don't read all the posts)

EDIT: ok, i think i found the one you are referring too. is it 'bitching anyone?'
yes, do you want me to report it again? i will gladly ...

[Matt]

These new posting rules were being discussed by Paul and I for a few days and we both hadn't kept on with the goings on in this thread. We both thought that the new smilies, flags, coloured text, and fonts were getting in the way of the content of the posts (which is the most important part of a forum). So this morning we decided to trim some of the distractions.

It's not your fault, or toe's.

I suggest we move on now. If this thread drags on a lot longer then I will close it.

[plover]

It's not often that I get lost but, after reading the above, I,m flummoxed. I showed this link (http://old.quinnware.com/forums/messages/81/7190.html?1067162544) to rory as an example of what I was talking about. (It's a page from the old QCD forum.) I figured I would post it in case I confused other people too.

[Todd The Kiwi]

These new posting rules were being discussed by Paul and I for a few days and we both hadn't kept on with the goings on in this thread. We both thought that the new smilies, flags, coloured text, and fonts were getting in the way of the content of the posts (which is the most important part of a forum). So this morning we decided to trim some of the distractions.

It's not your fault, or toe's.

I suggest we move on now. If this thread drags on a lot longer then I will close it.
not toes fault?? he started this shit man i'm just being me and he knocks me for it.
toe if you are reading this i hope you are very happy for stifling my creativity !!!!!!

[Todd The Kiwi]

i have an idea that may very well work > (http://beta.quinnware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1001)
leave wysiwyg intact BUT disable all sizes over 3 (http://beta.quinnware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1001)
(we can use sizes 1,2and 3) (http://beta.quinnware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1001)
and have a maximum of 2 colours per post (http://beta.quinnware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1001)
(excluding black because it is not a colour) (http://beta.quinnware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1001)
sound fair ?
(http://beta.quinnware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1001)


and please enable the cool smilies again, maybe only 20 or so ... (http://beta.quinnware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1001)

[Qaz]

Coloured text didn't bother me either. Well, just a little for first, but then I get used to them. You can disable signatures, avatars and images in User CP, so if it would be possible to add there an option to disable formatted text, everybody would be happy.

[Todd The Kiwi]

Coloured text didn't bother me either. Well, just a little for first, but then I get used to them. You can disable signatures, avatars and images in User CP, so if it would be possible to add there an option to disable formatted text, everybody would be happy.
:skull: this has been suggested and duely ignored man i feel we are wasting our time making these requests .
christ i'm not even allowed to use bold unless i'm emphasising something apparently i'm yelling ...:skull:


at least i can use the skulls (for now)

[Lich]

Guys, what are you calling "creativity"? Posts shining like decorated xmas tree? Damn, this is first time we got war on this forum for coloring of FLAME posts.
The only man I support is Plover because of his "code" explanation.

I've voted NO.

[Todd The Kiwi]

Guys, what are you calling "creativity"? Posts shining like decorated xmas tree? Damn, this is first time we got war on this forum for coloring of FLAME posts.
The only man I support is Plover because of his "code" explanation.

I've voted NO.
:skull:yeah well good on you man the majority of folk that have voted voted yes to creativity but that's just 70% or so, but i suppose they don't matter aye ...
as for "xmas trees" not mine man , toe is the king of that hill.:skull:

[Inthewoods]

Well, I guess I'll walk away from this foum for a bit. I thought this foum was spupposed to be a fun place to discuss QCD, and music and technology in general. but just reading this thread makes me feel like I'm reading the "AOL"amp forum...Gee Wiz, did I click on the wrong shortcut?? I'll be back when the dust settles...........

see ya

[hedge]

Well, I guess I'll walk away from this foum for a bit. I thought this foum was spupposed to be a fun place to discuss QCD, and music and technology in general. but just reading this thread makes me feel like I'm reading the "AOL"amp forum...Gee Wiz, did I click on the wrong shortcut?? I'll be back when the dust settles...........

see ya
hmmm ya know, i think he has a point.
I think some of us are taking this font's thing a little seriously... they are after all only fonts, and if we want to express ourselves visually, maybe we should keep it to walls, skins and icons etc.
If this is how much commotion is caused by this issue, maybe mat and paul had a very good point about the fact that visual aspects where taking away from the content of the forum...
And todd, maybe its time to stop blaming Toe for all this, mat has said multiple times that discussion had nothing to do with this decision... sure toe's made a few mistakes, but im sure you have made some in the past too...

[chicubs]

not toes fault?? he started this shit man i'm just being me and he knocks me for it.
toe if you are reading this i hope you are very happy for stifling my creativity !!!!!!

go suck on your bottle, baby....act like a grown man. Its freakin custom fonts, get over it. If thats the way you are creative...well, i think you get my point.

[Rex_Mundi_Incarnit]

Can this thread and any related threads be removed? Paul, Matt?

Thank you

And people, no more fuss about fonts, colours, emoticons, and any other settings please

[DeltaGuy]

Thank you for disabling sizes and fonts, they were Really starting to get on my nerves. It had come to a point that I simply used to skip over the posts of anyone that used a different font, because it was simply to annoying and hard to read...

[Todd The Kiwi]

go suck on your bottle, baby....act like a grown man. Its freakin custom fonts, get over it. If thats the way you are creative...well, i think you get my point.
that's not a bad little insult there "chicubs"
maybe i "shoudl" just get over it aye ,
as for a grown man,


i am. hmmm i'm sure all out insults are against "the rules" ...

[Todd The Kiwi]

Thank you for disabling sizes and fonts, they were Really starting to get on my nerves. It had come to a point that I simply used to skip over the posts of anyone that used a different font, because it was simply to annoying and hard to read...
that's a pity , i read all of them regardless .
if what you say is true, that means you don't really care about the content of the posts or the entire forum for that matter .
and get over mo' bird man it's only a browser.
i'm not the only one that's getting sick of "mo' this mo' that" in almost every post you make .
BUT to your merit at least you didn't "call me a name" and i suppose because this post is red and blue you'll never read it ...

[Young Twig]

This is a lame thread. Personally, I think text coloring and odd font faces are both annoying. Regardless, people need to chill. This thread is not something to leave about nor is it something to actually bother arguing in. Paul and Matt have the right to disable whatever they want to.

As for posting code... I think some HTML should be allowed. I know in phpBB you can allow only certain HTML tags. I think <a> <b> <i> <u> and <pre> should be allowed. Although, that would allow you to add some CSS which would kill the killing of custom fonts.

[Todd The Kiwi]

:skull: not that i want to tempt fate but..
this thing will get locked before i give up ...
not that i want it to get locked either
i just want wysiwyg (back)
am i still allowed to use bold? :skull:

[Young Twig]

Don't you know all the vB tags by now, Todd? :D

[DeltaGuy]

i suppose because this post is red and blue you'll never read it ... If you had read my post you would have realized that I said nothing about different colours, just different fonts and sizes... ;)

:skull: not that i want to tempt fate but..
this thing will get locked before i give up ...
not that i want it to get locked either
This is Matt and Paul's Forums, and they can do pretty much whatever they want. With an attitude like that, you'll just end up getting yourself banned from the forums, which I don't believe either of us wants to happen. WYSIWYG is gone, you'll just have to live with it. Unless you'd like to start up your own forums, there isn't much else you can do...

[chicubs]

that's not a bad little insult there "chicubs"
maybe i "shoudl" just get over it aye ,
as for a grown man,


i am. hmmm i'm sure all out insults are against "the rules" ...


sorry, i snapped, but you really, really, really need to get over this. Its not a big deal. Do you really need to right in ugly, annoying flashy colors? Do you need to whine about it extensively ?

[plover]

In the hopes of helping this situation to some kind of resolution I thought I would try to lay out the facts (at least as they are visible in this forum). In what follows, I intend to do my best not to ascribe motivation or cast judgement, but given that I am human I may fail, or I may choose words that can be misinterpreted. I can only request that readers of this post accept the assumption that I am writing in good faith. I offer my apologies for the length of this post; I doubt this problem will be served by an attempt at simplification.

-----------------------------

Here are some assumptions I am using (note, this is how I think things are; for these purposes, my opinion as to how things should be is neither here nor there):

1) This website is not a democracy, it's a dictatorship. This is Paul and Matt's sandbox, they make the rules. However, it is the "subjects" who get to decide if a dictatorship is benevolent.

2) Everyone who has posted in this matter is being truthful. There is no deceit to unravel.

-----------------------------

Feb 02:

1) Toe posts a complaint about heavily formatted posts to the "Bitching" thread

2) Toe gets flamed both in the forum and, apparently, in a PM from Todd

3) Toe responds; he includes the PM in his post; he also claims that the original post was a "joke"

4) More flames ensue

5) acozz attempts to quiet things down; everybody backs off; end of discussion

6) During the above, Todd apparently attempted to report one of Toe's posts via the forum abuse link; he apparently never received a response

Feb 06:

1) Matt anounces that font control is being removed from the forum

2) Todd blames Toe for this

3) Todd begins agitating for the return of fonts

4) Matt claims that both he and Paul were unaware of the Feb 02 discussion detailed above, and that their decision stemmed from other concerns

5) The lack of response to Todd's forum abuse report is brought up; I do not know if it was resolved

6) Much factionalization and flaming about fonts

7) Art forum is created (hey something positive :) )

-----------------------------

Now that I've laid out my view of the facts, I'll give a couple of comments.

Whether one approves or disapproves of the intent and/or presentation of Toe's message, I see no reason to doubt Matt that the discussion in the "Bitching" thread played no part in the decision to remove fonts. In other words, it is just a coincidence that Toe's post and the font removal were close together. My suspicion is that continuing to treat the two issues together will hinder any attempt at the resolution of either one.

I would also like to appeal to Matt and Paul not to let the degree and the form of the controversy surrounding this decision push them into taking up a hardened stance on the issue. And I would like to reiterate my plea for some reconsideration of the decision on the usage grounds I cited in my earlier post.

Thanks for listening.

[Hanzo]

Plover, I've taken the time to read your thread and agree with all your points and do think that your requests are fair and square. Please take the time to read the one I did in

http://www.quinnware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=8077&postcount=27

[Tokelil]

Thank you for disabling sizes and fonts, they were Really starting to get on my nerves. It had come to a point that I simply used to skip over the posts of anyone that used a different font, because it was simply to annoying and hard to read...I agree 100%.. I started with disabling avetars because I thought they took away too much focus, fellowed by disabling sigs. because they got to flashy. :-( This is not what I want from the QCD forum :-(

[bmc152003]

just listen to yourselfes, its just font with colors what the f*** is the big deal i mean come on you guys have to stop all this nonsense and just get on with your lives!