Rio Karma or Iriver IHP-120?

[chicubs]

I want to buy a new hard drive based player....I dont like the ipod, so dont tell me to get it (I cant live with 8 hours battery life!!!)....Both the Rio Karma and Irive IHP-120 have gotten exactly the same scores from everywhere and the reviews are absolutely glowing.

Pros of Ihp120
Basically the same size as Ipod.
plethora of features
-fm radio
-ogg
nice screen
remote
great customer service/firmware upgrades

Cons of Ihp120
-very expensive ($400) for 20gb
-no gapless playback for ogg (not sure about mp3)
-no visualizations (yes, a small touch but other players have it like Karma and Phillips HDD100

Pros of Rio Karma
-very, very small height,but chubby (preference, whether you want small and chubby or tall and lean)
-fairly cheap
-ogg!
purdy screen
visualizations
apparently the best menu system of any player (yes, even better than the ipod)

Cons of Rio Karma
no fm radio
rio isnt as trustworthy as Iriver
doesnt have as many tiny features as the Iriver

....The Iriver is the better player, I think, but its a little out of my budget. The only major advantages of it are the fm radio and maybe the form factor (im going to go a store and hold them both to check this out)

Also both have incredible battery life of about 14 hours
http://gearmedia.ign.com/gear/image/iriver_ihp120_prev_2_big.jpg

[Young Twig]

I find the best mp3 player to be Q...

I say the Rio, but I don't know what I am talking about. Also, FM radio sucks.

[chicubs]

Anyone whos done anything with either these players have any comments?....I might be buying one of them today, so I need those opinons fast...lol, Im a demanding person.

[Heigar]

Does the karma come with 20Gigs too?If so and you can live without the fm radio then I would go with the karma!

[chicubs]

really? which do you think looks cooler?

[chicubs]

just to clarify further Iriver = $399 and the Rio = $350....a big price eitherway . Also, I would probably use the fm radio but it obviously isnt a major buying factor.

[Heigar]

The Iriver looks cooler and if you would use the fm radio than you might as well pay the extra $50.

[Young Twig]

The iRiver looks like crap and FM radio sucks... I, personaly, would take the Rio.

[matty28carter]

i prefer the I-River, its supposed to be built like a rock as well...

[chicubs]

I just went to the store and checked out the ipod, karma, and Ihp120 and my impressions were:

Why do a lot of men like the ipod? I think it looks VERY feminine and I found its sound quality to be very lacking and Im not that picky aboout sound.

The Karma looks way too cheap to be $350 dollars. Too much plastic action.

The Iriver feels sturdy, but its not going to win any beauty contests, but I think I may go with it. It beats the Karma in looks and is masculine unlike the ipod (dont call me macho cause I dont like the ipod, its just a general feeling/impression) Its sort of like how the Palm Zire is marketed towards busy mothers and it looks very similar to the ipod.

[Young Twig]

The Iriver feels sturdy, but its not going to win any beauty contests

It's freakinhg ugly.

[chicubs]

It's freakinhg ugly.

i actually liked it...

[Todd The Kiwi]

i actually liked it...

which one did you get? is it any good ? you are quoting u.s dollars? that is sooooo expensive man fly to n.z and get the thing duty free . even if you made it out of the airport it's still way cheaper than that for electronic stuff down here. $400 u.s is like $600 kiwi bucks man i could buy a car for that. :D :confused:

[chicubs]

Actually, I didnt buy one of them, yet. Im going to austrailia very soon, but I would kinda like the player for the 20+ airplane trip. So, in general electronics are cheaper down there? Do you know a website that I could check out aussie prices?

[chicubs]

This is the player I based my skin "Antipod" roughly on. Its really nice and I might consider it. It lacks on FM radio, and its only 15gb, buts thats easily all I need. Ive heard really bad things about it, until recently because Philips reshipped all of its units with new firmware that fix the problems. People say it looks better than the ipod ....and thats pretty damn nice. Its .1inch bigger than the ipod all around and ways .3 ounces more, so I doubt i would notice the size. It doesnt support ogg which is a real downer, but its 100-120 dollars less than the Iriver so I may go with it. Oh, I forget, it also has a white on black display which just too sexy:p

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0000C4LNZ.01-A1NDBS7YGOPBD6.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

[hedge]

hmm aussie prices, try a google australia search, www.google.com.au, for what you want, should give ya plenty of aussie based results.

[chicubs]

doesnt look like Austrailia has Iriver products :(

[Matt]

i like the philips one.. its dead sexy

[chicubs]

i like the philips one.. its dead sexy

Ill probably buy one...but ill probably return it too :mad: Supposedly, the thing freezes/locks ups a lot.

[DeltaGuy]

The Rio, it looks prettier...
BTW, personally, I like the iPod (I wish I had one)...
Personally though, I'm getting a Palm Zire 71, which has MP3 playback...
It isn't as good as an MP3 player, but with a Digital Camera, it good for me...
So, just to clarify...
The Rio looks nicer, but it seems that the other one has better features...
Personally, I like style...

[chicubs]

I think Im going to blow my money on the Philips ( i know not a choica) and bear with the errors and hope they fix them with firmware upgrades (most of them are fixed already),

I found it for $100+ dollars cheaper than the iriver so thats my buy.

[Young Twig]

i like the philips one.. its dead sexy
word. it's mad cute.

[hedge]

what do ya think of the philips so far???

[chicubs]

what do ya think of the philips so far???

didnt buy anything yet....i dont know what to do. I see the archos movie/mp3 player and that looks unbelievable. It also double as a little portable tivo also. Its awesome but way too much dinero.....i may by the philips off ebay in the next couple days/weelks.

[Roj]

I want to buy a new hard drive based player....I dont like the ipod, so dont tell me to get it (I cant live with 8 hours battery life!!!)....Both the Rio Karma and Irive IHP-120 have gotten exactly the same scores from everywhere and the reviews are absolutely glowing.

Pros of Ihp120
Basically the same size as Ipod.
plethora of features
-fm radio
-ogg
nice screen
remote
great customer service/firmware upgrades

Cons of Ihp120
-very expensive ($400) for 20gb
-no gapless playback for ogg (not sure about mp3)
-no visualizations (yes, a small touch but other players have it like Karma and Phillips HDD100

Cons of both:

They'll both fail - sooner, rather than later. Hard drive players ALL end up that way - I won't touch them.

[grum]

They'll both fail - sooner, rather than later. Hard drive players ALL end up that way - I won't touch them.

That's not my experience. I don't know anyone that's had a problem with a HDD player. Obviously all hard disks have a lifespan, but I don't see why a disk in a music player should be any more susceptible to failure than say that in a laptop.

I've had an iRiver for a couple of weeks now and its been fantastic - the sound quality is much better than the iPod. Unfortunately the Karma wasn't available here in the UK at the time. I did consider the Philips which does look really cool but all the bad press put me off. It also shows up finger prints really badly.

By the way, if you think US prices are bad, you should see what we pay here in Rip-Off Britain.

Grum.

[DeltaGuy]

By the way, if you think US prices are bad, you should see what we pay here in Rip-Off Britain.
Ever been to Canada?

[Young Twig]

The prices are all the same. It's just different currencies. please, I've had too many arguments over this crap.

[DeltaGuy]

The prices are all the same. It's just different currencies.
No, prices are usually still inflated a little, plus we have to pay more for shipping, and even though our dollar has made LARGE gains against the US dollar, about $0.12 or more, prices on products imported are still the same...

[Hanzo]

No problems for currency here. Panama uses the US dollar as the standard currency. The bad thing is the shipping from US to Panama, which sucks big time.

DeltaGuy: you have a typo in your sig. It's "Tokelill" as far as I know...

[Roj]

That's not my experience. I don't know anyone that's had a problem with a HDD player. Obviously all hard disks have a lifespan, but I don't see why a disk in a music player should be any more susceptible to failure than say that in a laptop.
Kind of obvious, no? Laptops don't get bounced around nearly as much as a portable player in the hands of a teenager. Laptops don't go jogging. Laptops don't go to school in coat pockets on the bus. Laptops don't get dropped while you're running to catch said bus. Laptops don't...

Get the picture?

Hard drives have moving parts. CDs have less moving parts. They don't have heads that can collide with platter surfaces.

Hard drives + constant unpredictable mobility == accident waiting to happen.

[Young Twig]

DeltaGuy: you have a typo in your sig. It's "Tokelill" as far as I know...

I think it's "Tokelil."

[grum]

Kind of obvious, no? Laptops don't get bounced around nearly as much as a portable player in the hands of a teenager. Laptops don't go jogging. Laptops don't go to school in coat pockets on the bus. Laptops don't get dropped while you're running to catch said bus. Laptops don't...


I agree that if you abuse them, HDD players will fail, in the same way as any complicated mechanics will if mistreated. All I'm saying is for those of us willing to treat them with the respect they deserve there's no reason to expect them to be any more prone to failure than other, similar, technology. My laptop survives the daily commute via bus and underground (and actually I did drop it once whilst running for the bus with no ill-effect). Why shouldn't my HDD MP3 player be the same?

For the careful amongst us the advantages of a small player and no stack of CDs to take are indesputable.

[DeltaGuy]

I think it's "Tokelil."
You're right, it's been fixed...
That's what I get for not being able to paste into my Edit Sig Space...

[Roj]

For the careful amongst us the advantages of a small player and no stack of CDs to take are indesputable.
Let me put it this way:

I have three kids including a teenager. That puts a whole new shape on what constitutes "careful". :)

That age group is also the target market for such devices.

Thanks, but I'll pass on the expensive accident waiting to happen...

When flash devices exceed 1Gb (instead of the absolute stupidity that is the 128Mb MP3 player), I'll jump. Until then, I'll keep on with my nice, safe, stable and relatively bulletproof CD / MP3 player.

[dblpar007]

Anyone whos done anything with either these players have any comments?....I might be buying one of them today, so I need those opinons fast...lol, Im a demanding person.
The IRIVER is an excellent player and the FM does not suck.

[rorythedog]

Don't forget Minidisc. I use a Sony MZ-N1 and it's very good.

Good sound quality (as long as you use good bud-type earphones)

Small size (barely bigger than the disc itself)

Excellent battery life (48 hours on playback)

Blank minidiscs are easily and cheaply obtained (£1)

Extremely durable (I've dropped mine countless times)

Way sexier than any HD player

Relatively inexpensive

Only two downsides - Crap Sony software

Can't upload

BTW - No, I don't work for the Minidisc Marketing Board

Try here http://www.minidisc.org/

and here http://www.minidisct.com/

[Miester_V]

Karma. Its GUI is far more advanced and intuitive than the other mp3 players, iRiver included. Plus, it's the only one that can play gapless music, so if that's important to you, you have no alternative. Good thing that it's actually a great player all around.

[Roj]

Karma. Its GUI is far more advanced and intuitive than the other mp3 players, iRiver included. Plus, it's the only one that can play gapless music, so if that's important to you, you have no alternative. Good thing that it's actually a great player all around.
Neither of the two listed players for me - hard drives break. Period. There are however iRiver 512mb and 1Gb flash models about to be released that play not only mp3 and wma but ogg as well (in fact five new models will play ogg). They'll be out next month and June. I'll likely opt for the 512Mb model...

Oh, I almost forgot - they'll be gapless too.

[teedoff087]

I don't like mp3 players. They're too brittle for me. I'm pretty careful with my media players, but I couldn't afford to break something that costs $300.

Don't forget Minidisc. I use a Sony MZ-N1 and it's very good.

Good sound quality (as long as you use good bud-type earphones)

Small size (barely bigger than the disc itself)

Excellent battery life (48 hours on playback)

Blank minidiscs are easily and cheaply obtained (£1)

Extremely durable (I've dropped mine countless times)

Way sexier than any HD player

Relatively inexpensive

Only two downsides - Crap Sony software

Can't upload

BTW - No, I don't work for the Minidisc Marketing Board

Try here http://www.minidisc.org/

and here http://www.minidisct.com/

Me Like. I have one, too. I just use realplayer. I don't really like realplayer much, but much better than sonicstage.

[Roj]

I don't like mp3 players. They're too brittle for me. I'm pretty careful with my media players, but I couldn't afford to break something that costs $300.



Me Like. I have one, too. I just use realplayer. I don't really like realplayer much, but much better than sonicstage.Only one problem with them (apart from them being a Sony product :) ):

If you put mp3s, oggs or any lossy format on them, they take that lossy format and re-encode it to their own proprietary lossy encoding scheme again (lossless stuff of course gets encoded lossy too - the minidisc is NOT lossless), thus further degrading the audio quality.

That automatically ruled it out for me.

Also, my current MP3 / CD player was more cost effective - blank CD-RW are about $1.00 a disk and I can store 650 or 700Mb of MP3s on each. That works out to about 8 hours of music at 192bit and since battery life on this thing is effectively about 25 hours (whenever a vendor claims a figure, take it and multiply it by two thirds or even one half to get the real value, so those folks claiming 10 hours... ), I'm way ahead of the game. I can also play said CD-RW in my SUV CD / MP3 player.

But that's yesterday's solution - I want a flash player. No moving parts, USB 2.0, use explorer as a stadnard interface, doubles as a flash key to store stuff, beats the hard drive dreck all to hell since it doesn't break (BECAUSE it has no moving parts), no media to purchase...

[teedoff087]

I think that if you actually tried one, Roj, you wouldn't be disappointed. The sound quality isn't all that bad if you don't look at the kbps rate. The player has a built-in dsp to make the otherwise horrible quality audio into a much better sounding file. It also helps if you get better headphones instead of the flimsy ones that come with it. I also like the design of the minidisc. You can edit text on the player, move tracks around, and carry around extra minidiscs if you want to switch genres (the minidiscs are super-small). The only two things I don't like are:
1. SonicStage - crappy program, DRM, use RealPlayer (I don't prefer Real either but it works much better than SonicStage - no check-in/check-out).
2. Inability to upload files to hard disk - I probably wouldn't use this feature anyways but the software doesn't let you.
Plus, it's actually a lot cheaper than mp3 players. Battery life is unbelievable (when they make the claim of 48 hours on one AA battery, they're not lying). As far as breaking it, you would have to drop it from 5 stories. It also has a backlit LCD, unlike most other mp3 players. Flash players are also a good alternative to mp3, but I would prefer something more functional. I will definitely be looking at the upcoming 1 GB flash players, though.

[rorythedog]

I'ii wait a bit longer and have the chip implant, thank you very much. ;)

[Miester_V]

Neither of the two listed players for me - hard drives break. Period. There are however iRiver 512mb and 1Gb flash models about to be released that play not only mp3 and wma but ogg as well (in fact five new models will play ogg). They'll be out next month and June. I'll likely opt for the 512Mb model...

Oh, I almost forgot - they'll be gapless too.
Well, if you're looking for high activity mp3 players, I agree that going with flash would be a safer move. But some of us just like to take their music along without having to do any physical activities. Like laptops, mp3 harddrives are able to take minor bumps here and there. If you treat it like you treat a laptop, there shouldn't be any problems. Sooner or later there will be high capacity flash based players that will hold 20GB or more...

[regener8ed]

hadn't noticed this thread before.. so cubs.. what did you ever decide?

[Roj]

I think that if you actually tried one, Roj, you wouldn't be disappointed. The sound quality isn't all that bad if you don't look at the kbps rate. The player has a built-in dsp to make the otherwise horrible quality audio into a much better sounding file. It also helps if you get better headphones instead of the flimsy ones that come with it. I also like the design of the minidisc.Actually I did. I use Koss SportaPros and I don't like DSPs coloring my sound - I'm one of those who plays flat. I also didn't appreciate propretary media with limited capacity.

Have a look at these:

http://www.irivernordic.com/products.php?pid=44
http://www.irivernordic.com/products.php?pid=45


They are the new models coming from iRiver. The minidisc can't quite match up to them for versatility, capacity, speed of transfer or feature set. I'm personally hot and heavy on the 512Mb iFP-795 - the 1Gb model will definitely be far too expensive for my taste.

[chicubs]

hadn't noticed this thread before.. so cubs.. what did you ever decide?

nothin, decided not to waste money on it...going to mod my new car.

[chicubs]

Im back looking at hard drive players again and I am considering the Philips HDD100 (again b/c firmware fixed the problems and its cheap on ebay)....or spend the big bucks on the Cowon iAudio M3 which is a lot smaller than the ipod but with only a big screen on the remote....attached are some comparison shots.

[chicubs]

Comparing to miniipod

[chicubs]

Comparing to the Iriver

[chicubs]

I went to bestbuy today and purchased the Philips HDD120...I love it, its so nice and 20 gigs is plenty room...someone is helping me fill up the space. ;) ...Any recommendations for music for a guy who likes red hot chili peppers and coldplay?

[Todd The Kiwi]

blood sugar sex magik and parachutes , man .
do you like primus at all? frizzle fry is my favorite album of theirs perhaps you'll dig them perhaps you won't... :skull:

[chicubs]

blood sugar sex magik and parachutes , man .
do you like primus at all? frizzle fry is my favorite album of theirs perhaps you'll dig them perhaps you won't... :skull:

Ill check them out...Its not New Zealand Rap is it?

[Todd The Kiwi]

Ill check them out...Its not New Zealand Rap is it?

most certainly not mate they are from san francisco and are almost totally indescribable :apple: man i can't stand rap ...

[GildedSplinter]

Ill check them out...Its not New Zealand Rap is it?

I can't believe you're not at least vaguely familiar with Primus!!! They're an American band that have been around (in one incarnation or another) since the late '80's, and have toured extensively in our area. I was only a few months ago that they played an all day affair in Chicago with their original line up. It was a REALLY big deal. I do recommend them highly. Tim Alexander is an AMAZING drummer & Les Claypool does things to a 6 string bass, that are illegal in some states! :bandit:
If your interested in 2 (more) cents worth... look for a disc called "Whatcha Gonna Do, Honkey", by a band called "Honkey Toast". If you can find it on eBay or somethin', it's worth the hunt, and will certainly appeal to the Chili Pepper in ya. They're trying to conceal the fact that they're great musicians, by presenting themselves as booty shakin' trailor trash.
:beer: :coffee: :beer: :coffee: :
It may take a minute to get past the singer's bawdy, brash presentation... but it's good for a laugh & it'll make ya shake yer ass!!!

[chicubs]

I can't believe you're not at least vaguely familiar with Primus!!! They're an American band that have been around (in one incarnation or another) since the late '80's, and have toured extensively in our area. I was only a few months ago that they played an all day affair in Chicago with their original line up. It was a REALLY big deal. I do recommend them highly. Tim Alexander is an AMAZING drummer & Les Claypool does things to a 6 string bass, that are illegal in some states! :bandit:
If your interested in 2 (more) cents worth... look for a disc called "Whatcha Gonna Do, Honkey", by a band called "Honkey Toast". If you can find it on eBay or somethin', it's worth the hunt, and will certainly appeal to the Chili Pepper in ya. They're trying to conceal the fact that they're great musicians, by presenting themselves as booty shakin' trailor trash.
:beer: :coffee: :beer: :coffee: :
It may take a minute to get past the singer's bawdy, brash presentation... but it's good for a laugh & it'll make ya shake yer ass!!!

Yah, I dont know much about too many different bands.....I knew they were american, though, I was just joking around with Todd.

[Todd The Kiwi]

although i don't dig rap on any level there is one chick i have to mention
> MC TALI she does her thing with the full cycle crowd , roni sizi , crush , die etc... not bad for a young chick... :skull:

(full cycle are possibly the most prolific producers/dj's hailing from essentially bristol and the style is DRUM AND BASS)

[Todd The Kiwi]

ok i just voted for iriver because it looks cooler
the votes are now 50/50 how's that heh heh :skull:

[chicubs]

ok i just voted for iriver because it looks cooler
the votes are now 50/50 how's that heh heh :skull:

lol, I already bought a player!! The philips HDD120!!

[appurve]

Well i dont know about u guys :confused: but im gonna buy IHP-140 I river 40 Gb which is available for $450 singapore dollars :cool: . I hate ipod for some personal reason and Bugs. I dont wanna buy Rio Karma. The Philips player looks good but i would go for I River.